Star Wars Episode I: The Phantom Menace

[TordelBack]

2- Darth Maul in my Opinion could have done with more film time

You'll be happy to hear that SERIOUS SPOILERS FOR CLONE WARS SEASON 3 [spoiler]there's now another Sith Apprentice from the same family stock in the Clone Wars cartoon, and hints that Maul himself may not be as dead as he appears![/spoiler].  Not sure how I feel about that, actually.

[radiator]

i found TPM to be the worst if only for a few things :

I haven't watched The Phantom Menace in many years, but ISTR it has fewer cringe-inducing moments than Clones or Sith, though the latter two films at least have some exciting scenes going for them - my main memory of TPM is that it's mind-numbingly boring.

You'll be happy to hear that SERIOUS SPOILERS FOR CLONE WARS SEASON 3 [spoiler]there's now another Sith Apprentice from the same family stock in the Clone Wars cartoon, and hints that Maul himself may not be as dead as he appears!.  Not sure how I feel about that, actually.[/spoiler]

That sounds like the biggest load of bullshit ever to me. And what was all that about there only ever being two Sith? 

Just been watching Balance of the Force re-edit on Youtube - Only watched the first few minutes so far but already the plot is making a lot more sense - a lot of the alien and robot dialogue has been rewritten.

[klute]

[spoiler]I'd love to see them explain that, in my eyes he's dead and should remain so.[/spoiler]
In my eyes he was a very much under used character with potential, and sadly no body that works for GL or has the ability to say so hasnt said george really some of the decisions for the new SW films are awful

The Fans know what they want why not listen to some of what there saying/have said without getting silly.

[locustsofdeath!]

Six pages and no mention of R2-D2's ability to fly?

I had no problem with his flying or lack of in episodes 4,5,6 and just put it down to old age and a no longer functioning ability

Oh there's a part of me that wants to scream APOLOGIST right now  .

[TordelBack]

That sounds like the biggest load of bullshit ever to me. And what was all that about there only ever being two Sith?  

Indeed, the Rule of Two is the point being addressed by the storline so far -[spoiler] Sidious takes against Dooku's 'assassin' Ventress, who he feels is becoming too much like a third Sith, and thus a threat to him[/spoiler].  It makes a lot of sense in context -so far.[spoiler] The Darth Maul thing is only a rumoured hint at the end of the episode due to air in a fortnight, and it may refer to a spirit, an aspiration, a holocron, who knows, rather than the Cyborg Maul beloved of desperate sections of fandom, but it's certainly got people talking[/spoiler].

[klute]

Oh there's a part of me that wants to scream APOLOGIST right now

I think in all fairness if they were going to include the ability they should have been able to explain the lack of the ability later on rather than just have us wonder.

Especially when you consider how useful it would have been in 4,5,6

[TordelBack]

Especially when you consider how useful it would have been in 4,5,6

By my reckoning there's only three scenes where R2 might conceivably have used his flying ability in the OT (bearing in mind he only uses it twice in the prequels themselves).  Being Kenny Baker in a tin can he doesn't get many platformer action scenes.

1.  TESB:  getting off Luke's X-Wing on Dagobah.  He slipped and fell, no time to use it.  There's an argument that he must have used his jets to get back into the droid slot when Luke is preparing to leave, and out of it on the landing pad on Bespin, but seeing as Luke could have levitated him I'm not buying that myself.

2.  RotJ: getting off Jabba's sail barge.  This is the big one, but as suggested earlier Jabba's droid supervisor EV-9D9 might have had this ability deactivated to prevent the 'feisty little one' escaping (is that Locusts I hear shouting in the distance?).  He hardly needed it for serving drinks.  Pity he didn't search him for lightsabres.

3.  RotJ:  The net on Endor.  He clearly wouldn't have risked burning his comrades.

[locustsofdeath!]

That sounds like the biggest load of bullshit ever to me. And what was all that about there only ever being two Sith?  

Indeed, the Rule of Two is the point being addressed by the storline so far -[spoiler] Sidious takes against Dooku's 'assassin' Ventress, who he feels is becoming too much like a third Sith, and thus a threat to him[/spoiler].  It makes a lot of sense in context -so far.[spoiler] The Darth Maul thing is only a rumoured hint at the end of the episode due to air in a fortnight, and it may refer to a spirit, an aspiration, a holocron, who knows, rather than the Cyborg Maul beloved of desperate sections of fandom, but it's certainly got people talking[/spoiler].

The problem is that the PT trilogy shouldn't require a viewer to also watch a continuing television series, read x amount of books or comics, troll through George Lucas interviews and listen to movie commentary to fill in the gaps. A film or films should stand alone...all of this just feels like Lucas is making it up as he goes along and I think the amount of retconning he's done just to make the PT match up with the OT.

[locustsofdeath!]

(is that Locusts I hear shouting in the distance?)

Oh Tordel...

He could have used it to escape those horrible Jawas.

I'd liked to have seen R2 and Boba Fett have a jet pack jumping competition.

[radiator]

In my eyes he was a very much under used character with potential

People used to say the same about Boba Fett and Darth Vader, and look how that turned out.

Less is more, leave it be.

[klute]

By my reckoning there's only three scenes where R2 might conceivably have used his flying ability in the OT (bearing in mind he only uses it twice in the prequels themselves).  Being Kenny Baker in a tin can he doesn't get many platformer action scenes.

1.  TESB:  getting off Luke's X-Wing on Dagobah.  He slipped and fell, no time to use it.  There's an argument that he must have used his jets to get back into the droid slot when Luke is preparing to leave, and out of it on the landing pad on Bespin, but seeing as Luke could have levitated him I'm not buying that myself.

This scene for me was one of the ones i was thinking about..but in dagobah wasnt luke unable(at least at one point) to do such a task with rocks? and hadnt completed his training?

2.  RotJ: getting off Jabba's sail barge.  This is the big one, but as suggested earlier Jabba's droid supervisor EV-9D9 might have had this ability deactivated to prevent the 'feisty little one' escaping (is that Locusts I hear shouting in the distance?).  He hardly needed it for serving drinks.  Pity he didn't search him for lightsabres.

Maybe it "could" be explained away that this was when it was damaged?

3.  RotJ:  The net on Endor.  He clearly wouldn't have risked burning his comrades.

I agree 100%

[klute]

The problem is that the PT trilogy shouldn't require a viewer to also watch a continuing television series, read x amount of books or comics, troll through George Lucas interviews and listen to movie commentary to fill in the gaps. A film or films should stand alone...all of this just feels like Lucas is making it up as he goes along and I think the amount of retconning he's done just to make the PT match up with the OT.

I agree but put this down to GL thinking of new ways to make money out of 4,5,6
Rather than he fucked up on bits of the PT scripts either its money or he genuinely didnt look ahead when he was puttint 1,2,3 together

[klute]

I have always wondered how the films would have looked or how we would have viewed them had they been film from 1977 in order????

[TordelBack]

The problem is that the PT trilogy shouldn't require a viewer to also watch a continuing television series, read x amount of books or comics, troll through George Lucas interviews and listen to movie commentary to fill in the gaps.

Totally agree.  One of the biggest problems with TPM in particular is that it was structured and presented as a multi-media experience, not a film.  Lucasfilm were building on model of the vast non-film 'expanded universe' material that had grown up around the OT, clarifying and extending every detail, and they were (I suspect) assuming that this was what fans wanted from Star Wars - reams of supporting material around a spare frame of a movie.  Hardly any of the names we all know for ships, species and even characters actually appear on screen in the OT, so it must have appeared to be the way to go.  Fans were to be expected to traipse around (consuming LFL licnesed products all the while) putting the bigger story together as they went.  For example, Darth Maul (or rather the great Peter Serafinowicz) had more lines, and more character building, in the 'Tone Poem' TV commercial than he did in the film! (Here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vZE1UM6xpjM)

This was a huge  misjudgement, not least because the previous 'expanded universe' material had accreted over 20 years through a combination of games designers, toy makers, comics writers, fans and authors, and while much of it was crap it had the benefit of being diverse and organic, and based around a series of films that had a clear good-vs-evil plot with a beginning, middle and end that everyone understood.  With TPM everything was far from clear, and its 'expanded universe' was created professionally in one go, leaving it detailed but flat and unsatisfying, and as we would soon discover, to be contradicted almost immediately.  

[Jim_Campbell]

You'll be happy to hear that SERIOUS SPOILERS FOR CLONE WARS SEASON 3

It's been said that Lucas has been taking more of an interest in Clone Wars as the series has developed, and I'm assuming it's this that is inexorably sucking every last ounce of fun out of the series. Banking deregulation? Seriously, George?

Bah.

Jim