Digital readers are evil

[Colin YNWA]

E-readers will never replace books. My Kindle hasn't stopped me buying books. I will still go into charity shops and second-hand book shops to see if they have anything interesting. And you can't beat one of those big Coffee Table Books like the huge educational DK ones about Dinosaurs/The Human Body/Big Cats/Planes/&c, but I'm not taking them anywhere near the bath, never mind carelessly chuck it in a bag.

The thing is I think this will happen. As technology improves, and that happening at such a rate it won't be too long, the way people explore that sort of information will change (is changing). Younger folk at the college I work at, while they still use books, are also used to using eResources and the like to explore large complex ideas by moving in and out. Just think how intuitive using something like Google Maps is for many people.

Its also interesting as the more this way of reading takes hold the second hand market will diminish. Great news for the comics publishers. Items that have been sold in back issue bins for years will be made available by them (are available from them). They get the cash with very little additional expense. 

[The Prodigal]

Whether for books or comics, newspapers or magazines, they lack the tactile longevity of paper. You can't take an eReader in the bath. You can't flick its pages and smell times gone past. You can't toss it in a bag and be sure it will be readable. You can't share it with someone you know will like it.

They are the work of the devil.

I am jumping up and down in my Norn Iron home applauding this post. You are a moral giant sir. A titan and champion of all that is good in this world.

[TordelBack]

For myself, I inhabit a shadowy netherworld between these poles.  Our house is exploding with books, and even after last year's mammoth bookshelving-ebaying-and-charity-shop-donation projects we somehow still have an attic and shed full of piles and boxes.  This despite having stopped buying more than a handful of books for the past four or five years, as we've shifted almost exclusively to using the library for financial reasons.  In many ways shifting to the library combines the non-ownership and transient aspects of the digital world with the physical experiences of the traditional. 

At the same time, I access a lot of older research material in static scanned-print PDF form, and this I bloody hate. However, I have actually bought my first few new digital (RPG) books which I read on my PC, and I've been quite pleasantly surprised by the experience, the cross-referenced maps and links particularly.   I only bought them digitally because I couldn't afford the paper version, and more specifically the shipping - I definitely miss the ability to flick back and forth, and to have a handy stack beside the bed.  I do suspect that if I had a hand reader/pad device to make things more portable I might not mind this aspect so much.

So. I'm left surrounded by a mountain of lovely mouldering books that permit me all the tactile haptic experiences I could want, but they're pretty much all a decade or more old, and pretty much everything I'm actually reading now is nowhere in evidence.  I can't see that a move to digital will change this very much, once I can get over the hurdle of unfamiliarity, but I know I will miss the random encounters with old friends as I move through the house.

[sheldipez]

I think the whole digital thing with comics comes down to purely to one's personal tastes, for me there's four reasons why I won't touch digitial

1 Another electronic device. There's so much I do with a screen (I work on a screen all day on one, watch TV with the wife, gaming on a screen, browsing net on my phone etc.) I have no desire for my comics to be another one of those activities where I'm staring at a display. Downtime at the end of my day relaxing with something that doesn't need charging is something I look forward to. The only reason I got a Kindle was that the Paperwhite model got to the point where (IMO) it really resembled paper and it's much easier reading 1000+ page sci-fi epics on it than struggling to heave the weight of the hardcover.
2 I don't have a lack of space so digital serves no advantage to me. The ability to have my entire book shelf stored away on a kindle is great because where as with comics which I may read a few times in the same year, books I tend to revisit every few years or never again. So keeping novels I've read really isn't that important but it's nice to know that I still have a book saved if in the rare chance I want to re-read it. I love my longboxes of comics, but I have my converted loft room all to myself so storage isn't a problem in the slightest for me.
3 Price. I couldn't part with the cash for the price of an ereader as I'd just think "I could finish my run of xxxx off" or "I could buy all those TPB volumes I've been wanting to grab"
4 I love the chase! I love hunting down old comics or out of print graphic novels. I love that part of the hobby, going to comixology and hitting "purchase" takes the fun out of it. I like selecting which variant cover I want to own, I like the choice having my TPB or comic signed by the author or artist.

Now if I lived in a small apartment with less time or money to put into comics then I'm sure my decisions would be the total opposite!

[Proudhuff]

1 Another electronic device. There's so much I do with a screen (I work on a screen all day on one, watch TV with the wife, gaming on a screen, browsing net on my phone etc.) I have no desire for my comics to be another one of those activities where I'm staring at a display. Downtime at the end of my day relaxing with something that doesn't need charging is something I look forward to.

This is the main reason for me, that and learning yet another menu/set of buttons/scroll device/wotevea

[Definitely Not Mister Pops]

Whether for books or comics, newspapers or magazines, they lack the tactile longevity of paper. You can't take an eReader in the bath. You can't flick its pages and smell times gone past. You can't toss it in a bag and be sure it will be readable. You can't share it with someone you know will like it.

They are the work of the devil.

I am jumping up and down in my Norn Iron home applauding this post. You are a moral giant sir. A titan and champion of all that is good in this world.

Well that's hardly surprising. Everyone knows we're all backward and live in the past here in Norn Iron

[radiator]

Yeah, iPads are so complicated to use aren't they?

[James Stacey]

I fully agreed with the OP until I got a kindle. It's an awesome device and I love it. I still have a large collection of books and still buy new physical books, but there is definitely room for both. I love new book smell. I love old book smell. I love my collection of books many of which are over 70 years old, but I also love my kindle. So there.

[The Adventurer]

They literally have studies that show five year olds can navigate an iPad's GUI with out instruction, because its so straight forward.

Literally flabbergasted that readers of a science fiction anthology are so afraid of new technology.

[radiator]

I think the turning point for me was the retina display - before then I was skeptical about digital comics, and was not interested in reading comics on my iphone or desktop computer - but if you haven't read comics on the new ipad, you're being wilfully ignorant and a bit of a luddite to dismiss it out of hand (I know certain anti-digital people on this thread are being a bit tongue in cheek, but others seem quite serious). It really isn't like looking at a conventional screen. I love print as much as the next guy, but print comes with it's own drawbacks in terms of presentation. Comixology is a hugely impressive piece of software - and while there are still a few kinks that need ironing out, using it is an absolute delight. Believe me, scrolling through the beautifully presented menu of all you purchases gives almost - almost - the same warm glow you get from admiring a lovely bookshelf.

To me the downsides of digital are:

The weight of the tablet (not unusably heavy, but still surprising weighty).

The lack of onboard storage (which limits you from carrying around a huge library of comics and trades - anything purchased may be deleted and redownloaded whenever you like, but it still feels impermanent in a slightly finnicky way that bugs the completist mentality).

The nagging sense of vague anxiety that one day all your purchases may become obsolete.

The relative cost/value/fragility of the tablet itself and the various issues that come with that.

The Comixology App occasionally crashes, especially when scrolling quickly (but then you can sometimes accidentally lose your place in a book).

Ummm, that's really all I can think of. The advantage of convenience alone does more than enough to balance them out. Issues like the 'book smell' (though I understand where it comes from) are to me somewhat silly and irrelevant, and a lot of people seem to be really reaching for arguments against digital.

[Colin YNWA]

The retina display is what 9' 7'' corner to corner, or something like that I believe, even an american comic is something like 12' corner to corner and for me that does make a difference*

I had a good long play with my Dad's 10 inch display over X-Mas (this wasn't retina of course and it might be apples and oranges?) and the reduced size did bug me. Not sure if that's me finding an excuse or what, but I was conscious of it. Sure you could zoom in, which is fun but kinda chanced the purpose of a full page splash, let a lone a double page splash. I also found the transition between pages too smooth, perverse as that sounds, but its things like the timing of a page turn that help define how a comic works for me.

Another beef I had (I was using Comixology) was if you used the panel by panel function, to try to compensate for the page being smaller, the feel (not of the reproduction that was fine, rather how close in you were) of the art in the panels changed as it zoomed in or out depending on the area being looked at. There might be settings etc that can help with this etc but all this affected my enjoyment.

*Which makes me wonder if its just me being stuck in the mud, as I don't have a beef with the Dark Horse omnibuses and soon get used to their reduced page size.

[radiator]

I had a good long play with my Dad's 10 inch display over X-Mas

Sorry, I hate it when some smartarse quotes double entendres out of context, but I couldn't resist this time.

As for the zooming in thing, I don't bother with it. It's a neat function, but in my mind it turns a comic into a static storyboard - you lose the flow of a well-designed page. It also pixellates quite a bit.

[Colin YNWA]

You should have seen what I first typed, but then I thought I can't use a really greasy double entrendres about my Dad, that's just unpleasant. It would seem I failed to sanitise it completely!

[Jim_Campbell]

Another beef I had (I was using Comixology) was if you used the panel by panel function, to try to compensate for the page being smaller, the feel (not of the reproduction that was fine, rather how close in you were) of the art in the panels changed as it zoomed in or out depending on the area being looked at. There might be settings etc that can help with this etc but all this affected my enjoyment.

I'm unconvinced by Comixology's 'guided view' -- it seems to me to smack of them attempting to 'add value' to their package in effort to justify the (IMO) outrageously large slice of the cover price they take from each book.

Cheers

Jim

[radiator]

outrageously large slice of the cover price they take from each book.

I did wonder about how much money goes to the publisher/artists. Seems weird that Marvel and DC would bend over and take it. Maybe they get special terms?

Also makes sense of why 2000ad have their own App, much as I'd prefer to have all my digi comics in one place.