I don't like superheroes anymore. Do you like superheroes?

[IntotheRealm]

I still however lavish in back issues of sterotypical hero comics. Just this morning for example I was reading some of John Byrne's Superman run which I collected relatively recently.

Phew thanks Colin, reading this interesting thread your posting turned my frown upside down.  The future is in the past.....

Wendy


 

[Dark Jimbo]

I 'inherited' a big box of Marvel comics from my Dad in the early 90s - they were the original runs of Thor, X-Men, Spiderman and Iron Man from the 1960s, that he'd collected as a boy (think there may have been some Doctor Strange and Hulk, too). I absolutely devoured them - weeks of my life were lost to those damn things. I was soon ripping off characters and plotlines for school projects, copying panels and plotting out my own epic space-operas. After a year or two I moved on to other things.

I've never felt the urge to pick up a superhero comic since. I feel exactly the same way about them as Spaceghost, frankly - but I can't even summon any enthusiasm for their big screen outings, either (with the occassional exceptions of Spiderman and Batman). I don't care how 'awesome' Downey Jr is meant to be as Iron Man, I don't care how good Whedon's Avengers film is supposed to be, I just have no interest in seeing them. And even less in picking up a Marvel/DC comic, even though comics in general count for a huge chunk of my spare time.

They're just so damn silly, in the most inherent way possible - I can see why they appeal to children, I can see why they appealed in the depression of the 1930s, but why on earth they're supposed to appeal to me now I have no idea. And to be honest they're the main reason I don't like telling people that I read comics - I couldn't stand to have them thinking I was eagerly devouring the weekly exploits of Superman or the like, even though I'd sing the praises of Tharg's output without shame.

[von Boom]

No I'm not into superheroes any more. Early on I read quite a bit of Spiderman and Daredevil, but even then I was never fanatical about them. Mostly I'd get interested in one for a while and follow for a few months, but then I'd get bored and move on to something else.

It probably stems from not having much in the way of pocket money and for the price of a couple of comics I could buy a book instead. Outside of the prog and Meg the only comics I read now are generally science fiction or fantasy related.

[Recrewt]

Since I came back to the comics world I have tried to not limit myself to one particular genre.  Whilst it is true that there are plenty of so-so superhero comics, there is also lots of great stuff that has come out over the years e.g. Dark Knight Returns, All Star Superman, Planet Hulk.   

I do agree though that there is a problem with some of these comics that just run forever and don't really have a start, middle and end - most of the best stuff I have ever read does.   

[Colin YNWA]

... And to be honest they're the main reason I don't like telling people that I read comics - I couldn't stand to have them thinking I was eagerly devouring the weekly exploits of Superman or the like, even though I'd sing the praises of Tharg's output without shame.

Oh boy I'm turning into the man defending superhero comics, that's a man I don't want to be, its an easy target. Alan Moore if he could careless would have some very caustic things to say about my emotional development I'm sure... some of his more dedicated followers here might likewise... ANYWAY enough silly comments to me beef (which will contain a load more I'm sure).

This type of thing drives me spare. Why should we be ashamed about our choice or reading or any other entertainment (that doesn't harm any other bugger that is). Why should Dark Jimbo be worried that reading comics is associated with superhero stuff. It doesn't chuffin' matter, or least ways damn well shouldn't. Surely we've moved on from that, or if we haven't its up to the comic readers out there to continue the shift. In 1986 - 198 chuffin'- 6 we started to see newspaper articles stating 'Comics have grown up at last' almost 20 years ago. Loads of popular culture is now formed around things that were once firmly in the remit of nerds and geeks. Zombies are big news, superhero movies the biggest grossing films year on year (that might not actually be a fact but I'm on a roll here so please bear with me), computer games played by millions deal with post apocalypse alien invasions (see previous bracketed statement). Half the telly and film that are big news are created by people who grew up reading comics (you know the drill by now).

We've moved on.

If you're worried that some bugger would look down at you for reading a comic that they might - MIGHT -associate with superheroes point them to the lines of people that will be outside several potential massive movies this summer about just that thing. Let them know that comics aren't just superheroes, don't be ashamed be out and be proud. I wipe mine out in public on a regular basis, if anyone has a problem with that that really is their's and their ignorance. If they smirk at my superhero reading, well fine and dandy really not my problem and I'm still sure they are by and large a nice person but I'll hide no more I tells ya.

Hell even this anachronistic (look at me trying to use posh words to bolster by pro-capes naively optimistic rant) idea that ALL superhero comics are an on-going endless soap opera is just plain silly. There are hundreds of perfectly good superhero comics out there that have perfectly good beginnings, middles and ends. People need to get over their trite little sterotypes and start to see the big picture. THINGS HAVE MOVED ON PEOPLE. Hell and even if people (me) want to read some of those unending soaps in just the same way that people, millions of um, literally millions of um in this country alone, do with other soap operas - so the chuff what!

That's not to say you don't have the perfect right to not like superheroes, you of course have the perfect right not to like superheroes, good luck to you and no hard feelings. Its just the same as not liking horror, or westerns, or kitchen sink drama, whatever. Its no more or less valid and the people who do like um no more or less intelligent.

People come to entertainment with different needs. SpaceGhost try doing a bit of research, as I have, to the needs that some readers of Mills and Boon bring to those books and why they chose to read them before standing in of so superior judgement of them. You might be surprised and that self important bubble burst a little...

... but that's quite enough ill thought out, poorly constructed stream of consciousness yelling from me.

I'm going home.

On the train.

With Clark, Lois and Lex fully on show and not a care in the world about that.   

[Recrewt]

I wipe mine out in public on a regular basis

Good thing I wasn't drinking tea when Colin dropped this particular typo into his post.  My colleague would have been covered! 

I agree there is no shame in reading whichever comics you like and there is definitely an elitism and snobbery around some.

[Colin YNWA]

I wipe mine out in public on a regular basis

Good thing I wasn't drinking tea when Colin dropped this particular typo into his post.  My colleague would have been covered! 

I agree there is no shame in reading whichever comics you like and there is definitely an elitism and snobbery around some.

For once that was intentional. I've 'wiped them out before.'

[Recrewt]

OK, my bad! 

[Colin YNWA]

OK, my bad! 

not really given my track record a typo was a fair bet!

[Spaceghost]

With all due respect to you Colin, you haven't particularly answered any of my criticisms, you've just said "Well I like them so NER!" which, I suppose, is fair enough.

I think they're almost entirely shit, and I view them as the same sort of 'content' as a Westlife album, Fast and Furious 17, or Heat magazine.

The 'Comics Grow Up!' headlines you refer to from the 80's were inspired by Watchmen and Dark Knight Returns being big sellers and finding favour with various book types and magazine writers. Comics didn't really 'grow up' in any real way and the mainstream quickly fell back into it's boring ways.

[Frank]

Like many above, the only comics I'd read before 2000ad were DC Thomson kids humour titles, like The Beano and Oor Wullie, and Asterix and Tintin books from the library. I remember getting a UK Batman reprint when I was five or six, but it was crap compared to the TV show. One of the reasons I took to the work of Wagner, Grant, Mills, Morrison and Milligan when I made the jump to 2000ad was because they were so funny, as well as smart.

The US titles of that period all seemed to be issue number ones by Image writer/artists which were pretty hilarious, but not intentionally so. The Marvel and DC stuff was anachronistic and awful looking, so the only US books I picked up were those that Speakeasy told me were good, which tended to be stuff like Watchmen, Dark Knight, Love and Rockets, Hate, Sandman, Hellblazer, Eightball, and Calvin and Hobbes.

The only US comics I've picked up in the intervening years have been those written by writers I like, who don't generally seem to write superheroes, and the only cape books I've taken a gamble on were the Morrison/Quitely X-Men (meh) and Alan Moore's Wildcats and Top Ten (yay!). Comics are largely something for giving me a laugh; the only superhero stories I'm interested in are the same obviously good stuff that even people who aren't really interested in comics have read too.

[Theblazeuk]

I like superhero comics. Not many of the ones currently going it has to be said.  But one day they will be good again, I have faith. It wasn't that long ago I was reading Dan Abnett write galaxy-spanning wars in both Marvel and DC.  And I'd go back and read All Star Supes, even Man of Steel, so much of the old stuff. It's just the current wave of bland action that I wouldn't bother with.

I still read Spiderman and you know what? I enjoy it. It's not the 'ludicrousness of a guy who thinks tights is the best way to fight crime'. It's the fun of a guy who has amazing spider powers and saves people who need it - and has lots of weird interesting scifi/crime fun along the way. And I read Wonder Woman, which is doing great things with Greek Mythology, similar to how Thor writers have mined Norse mythology for some cracking reads.

Still enjoy Invincible too. Oh and Absolution was a good series though firmly in the 'kill everything' camp. And when Miracleman gets collected, I'll grab that.

I suppose the more I think about it, the less I am reading comics about 'fighting crime'. The superheroes in most of the things I read are not fighting muggers or anything that straightforward. Spidey is the only one I can really think of from the top of my head. The childish thing at the heart of superheroics is the hope that one person can save another, that a human being can be insulated from the dangers of doing the right thing by some kind of exceptionalism.

And Spaceghost I can see rebuttals to all of your criticisms in Colin's posts. Superhero comics are so prolific they literally contain every good point extolled by Colin and every bad point raised by you. There are others out there and less sneering ways of expressing your opinion are available too.

[Professor Bear]

Another thing to consider is that a lot of what constitutes a superhero story is in the eye of the beholder, as 2000ad fans don't seem to have a problem with Nikolai Dante and his super-powered swords, or the constant stream of supervillains in those Hondo City stories in the Meg who fight a masked, gadget-equipped hero in a skintight costume (latterly accompanied by a powered kid sidekick), or MACH 1's super "hyper" powers that make him run at super hyper speed, give him super hyper strength, etc.

[Spaceghost]

When I'm 'sneering' you'll know about it.

[Spaceghost]

Another thing to consider is that a lot of what constitutes a superhero story is in the eye of the beholder, as 2000ad fans don't seem to have a problem with Nikolai Dante and his super-powered swords, or the constant stream of supervillains in those Hondo City stories in the Meg who fight a masked, gadget-equipped hero in a skintight costume (latterly accompanied by a powered kid sidekick), or MACH 1's super "hyper" powers that make him run at super hyper speed, give him super hyper strength, etc.

As I said, I don't have a problem with fantasy elements or even super powers. Take your example, Nikolai Dante. It doesn't suffer from any of the things I mentioned.

The story has a beginning, a middle and a definite end, the character changes, grows and develops throughout. Characters form relationships, change and (usually) die. The super-swords are immaterial to my argument. If Dante went on and on, fighting the same bad guys over and over again whilst not aging or developing, THAT would be a valid comparison.