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Author Topic: The completely self absorbed 2000ad re-read thread  (Read 156213 times)

Funt Solo

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Re: The completely self absorbed 2000ad re-read thread
« Reply #975 on: 14 August, 2020, 06:19:28 AM »
I find Zombo a bit Marmite - there's no question that it's well written, and it has genuine tea-splattering jokes. I think it's better in small doses, is all. Which is probably a weird thing to say about something that's so deliberately OTT.

Cradlegrave's a weird one, as well. I rate it very highly as effective horror - to the extent that I don't want to re-read it because it's truly unsettling. In that regard, I think it deserves the plaudits, but I'd never say it's comfortable entertainment.
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broodblik

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Re: The completely self absorbed 2000ad re-read thread
« Reply #976 on: 14 August, 2020, 06:46:34 AM »
Zombo is me almost like Ulysses Sweet a psychotic anti-hero treated like a "hero". Almost indestructible characters which has no moral compass.
Old age is the Lord’s way of telling us to step aside for something new. Death’s in case we didn’t take the hint.

The pen is mightier than the sword if the sword is very short, and the pen is very sharp.

Colin YNWA

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Re: The completely self absorbed 2000ad re-read thread
« Reply #977 on: 14 August, 2020, 06:53:53 AM »
Zombo is me almost like Ulysses Sweet a psychotic anti-hero treated like a "hero". Almost indestructible characters which has no moral compass.

The reason Zombo works for me is he feels such much better 'constructed'. I completely see what you mean with the comparison but that repressed agression makes so much sense with Zombo... okay, okay sense seems a silly thing to say in the context of a hyperpolite zombie - but within story. His gruesome fixed grin perfectly displaying utter frustration in his forced restraint.

The contrast works so well as well. He's beautfully contrasted and therefore the unrestrained world in which he operates makes so much sense, as Funt Solo says in that its all so deliberately OTT.

Cradlegrave's a weird one, as well. I rate it very highly as effective horror - to the extent that I don't want to re-read it because it's truly unsettling. In that regard, I think it deserves the plaudits, but I'd never say it's comfortable entertainment.

Yeah I've read it a few times now and this is so true. Its brutal reality doesn't make it an easy read at all. Its not so much entertaining as compelling for me.


broodblik

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Re: The completely self absorbed 2000ad re-read thread
« Reply #978 on: 14 August, 2020, 07:22:26 AM »
One thing about Zombo that I do get and appropriate more is the satire whereas with mister Sweet it is just to lopsided  towards the psychosis of the character.
Old age is the Lord’s way of telling us to step aside for something new. Death’s in case we didn’t take the hint.

The pen is mightier than the sword if the sword is very short, and the pen is very sharp.

Funt Solo

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Re: The completely self absorbed 2000ad re-read thread
« Reply #979 on: 14 August, 2020, 03:52:25 PM »
Zombo is me almost like Ulysses Sweet a psychotic anti-hero treated like a "hero". Almost indestructible characters which has no moral compass.

I can handle Zombo being a non-hero because (like I said, in smaller doses) I can get into the comedy - which is really what the strip's for. With Ulysses, I can see it's trying to do the same thing, but I think it veers too much into Big Dave territory by (at least on some level) coming across as an excuse to be horribly sexist.

As for "indestructible characters which [have] no moral compass", don't get me started on Sinister Dexter!
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broodblik

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Re: The completely self absorbed 2000ad re-read thread
« Reply #980 on: 14 August, 2020, 04:17:54 PM »
As for "indestructible characters which [have] no moral compass", don't get me started on Sinister Dexter!

I can at least consume bits and pieces of Sin/Dex  but I do not think I will ever be a true fan of the strip.
Old age is the Lord’s way of telling us to step aside for something new. Death’s in case we didn’t take the hint.

The pen is mightier than the sword if the sword is very short, and the pen is very sharp.

Colin YNWA

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Re: The completely self absorbed 2000ad re-read thread
« Reply #981 on: 14 August, 2020, 04:44:59 PM »
As for "indestructible characters which [have] no moral compass", don't get me started on Sinister Dexter!

I wrote about that quite a bit for some blog or other a few years ago now. I got it covered

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Colin YNWA

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Re: The completely self absorbed 2000ad re-read thread
« Reply #982 on: 22 August, 2020, 08:39:28 PM »


Holiday Gold

While I was away I got to my lastest jumping off point - normally a jumping on point (and read the things I was reading inbetween to). The run up to Prog 1650 has a lot to offer, so some quick thoughts to catch up.

1. One of the great things about this period I'm calling the NuGolden Age is it has some pretty iconic moments. Moment #1 The hammersteins storming the beach in Savage. Both the fantastic cover of Prog 1641 by Patrick Goddard and the strip itself. Savage is at a real peak, showing that a cross over can be so much more than a gimick. But can all the power and excitment just the same.

2. As we approach 1650 there's a high strip rotation. Sinister Dexter pops back in with a couple of stories with Anthony Williams joining Dan Abnett. This period gets a hard time by many but is one of my favourites and I wish it hadn't be brushed aside in the recent Podcast with the artist. Heyho can't have it all.

3. In 'Wish you were here' we get another great recap of events to keeps folks in tune. A cool gimick as John Croak crosses dimensions and sees all sorts of interesting shadows as he does so. Finally Finny and Ramone have a chance encounter in 'Aisles of Plenty' with unfortunate consequences.

4. Prog 1644 is great for so many reasons. We get the ultra creepy Bonehinge introduced in Sinister Dexter

5. The even more creepy ending to Cradlegrave. Its both horrific and in its final moments full of hope.

6. Red Seas also rolls in with another great filler story featuring Newton leaving the Library and finding a Pegsus.

7. Prog 1645 sees Chris Weston exorcise his book club demons with a terrific Terror Tale. There a nice mix of one off in this period, with Bob Byrne's bolstering the roster

8. There's also a run of Dredd's that make a folly of those that say if its not Wagner it doesn't count. Ian Edginton and Dave Taylor introduce Judge Lamia and Al Ewing introduces a redemptive parallel Dredd. Its wonderful stuff.

9. Prog 1649 sees Tracy Weld make a desperate move and Wagner return to Dredd to send Joe into exile. Its a stunning Prog to lead into a new line-up on.

10. The fact that we have such a strong line-up in a period of rotation and clearing the decks shows what a fantastic place the Prog is in. Maybe I view this period has it hits a high just when we've back in our stride together... but it might just be because the Prog is in such a wonderful place in 2009?

 

Colin YNWA

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Re: The completely self absorbed 2000ad re-read thread
« Reply #983 on: 25 August, 2020, 09:04:57 PM »


Prog 1650 +2

Well if what we had before was good and a strong arguement for the start of the NuGolden Age (TM) then its Prog 1650 and the subsequent line-up that nails it.

Prog 1650 starts 'Tour of Duty' - one of my all time favourite Dredd epics. Then DOUBLE Shakara in 'The Destroyer' and DOUBLE Kingdom as 'Call of the Wild' starts. I mean this is pure 2000ad isn't it. If only three thrills, which normally annoys me - here the issue is so kinetic, behind a fantastic Chris Weston cover that I got over it this time.

Things get better though. In Prog 1651 'Tour of Duty' sets out its stall about how great its going to be in a scene without Dredd as Dan Franciso shows why he was so well regarded and in a surprise to all stands up the Martin Sinfield, to show commitment to Justice. At the same time showing the brutal norm for how Judges cover the costs. Its a page and half of talking heads (well Colin MacNeill does that so well it doesn't feel like it) but it shows Wagner's genius. Covering so much, moving plot, revealing character so effortlessly yet so well its hard to fathom how. Next issue we get giant spider attacks. Christ this story has it all!

Prog 1651 also adds Dante with a story centred on Lulu and Strontium Dog with a tale coming out of Blood Moon but very much its own things.

Now this is gold for sure.

AlexF

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Re: The completely self absorbed 2000ad re-read thread
« Reply #984 on: 27 August, 2020, 07:28:49 AM »
I don't dispute that 1650 is peak nuGold era, it's just for me the gold begins one mega-epic earlier, with the start of Origins.

And while I'm disagreeing (in a kind of agreeing with you way), did you not get a bit annoyed in Sinister Dexter that Dexter just gets healed kind of quickly and easily? I agree Williams is doing stellar work, especially with the bonecruncher design - but why does Ramone need his spine/legs back? Rocky Rhodes did perfecetly well on a set of robot legs, and I reckon Abnett could've had a lot of fun with a hitman in a wheelchair controlled by one of those mouth-tube contraptions...

Colin YNWA

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Re: The completely self absorbed 2000ad re-read thread
« Reply #985 on: 27 August, 2020, 08:53:45 AM »
I don't dispute that 1650 is peak nuGold era, it's just for me the gold begins one mega-epic earlier, with the start of Origins.

Yeah I agree the nuance of exactly when nuGolden Age (TM) starts is a pretty individual decision. I figure some folks would push it back even further than that and I make an arguement - with myself - that 2005 is so good it should start there...

And while I'm disagreeing (in a kind of agreeing with you way), did you not get a bit annoyed in Sinister Dexter that Dexter just gets healed kind of quickly and easily? I agree Williams is doing stellar work, especially with the bonecruncher design - but why does Ramone need his spine/legs back? Rocky Rhodes did perfecetly well on a set of robot legs, and I reckon Abnett could've had a lot of fun with a hitman in a wheelchair controlled by one of those mouth-tube contraptions...

I defo see you point, though I'd have actually liked more around the sinister creepy Bonehenge and whether he could be trusted and when the work was done was there something else going on, had something else been 'added'.

That said I think what was most interesting was the idea of a hit man who couldn't shoot straight - and the gunning of Kal was a nice conclusion to that. What I also liked was the character stuff about Ramone not being able to face up to it and not telling Finny. I'd have liked that to have been worked a little harder maybe. After all these depend on yeah other utterly. We see time and again their lowest moments are when the are split up. So the fact Ramone didn't turn to Finny earlier was interesting to me.

broodblik

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Re: The completely self absorbed 2000ad re-read thread
« Reply #986 on: 27 August, 2020, 07:11:32 PM »
Yes, this was a great time reading the prog.

I am not a big fan of Anthony Williams art but his work on Sin/Dex was for me his best work yet. Did he actually do anything for the prog after his stint was over on Sin/Dex?
Old age is the Lord’s way of telling us to step aside for something new. Death’s in case we didn’t take the hint.

The pen is mightier than the sword if the sword is very short, and the pen is very sharp.

AlexF

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Re: The completely self absorbed 2000ad re-read thread
« Reply #987 on: 28 August, 2020, 09:57:45 AM »
I don't think he did. He worked on Cursed Earth Karnage in the Megazine that was perhaps a little later, and was, sad to say, one of the worst strips to run in the Megazine. Not really Williams's fault - and I'm surprised he hasn;t shown up in a Regened Prog as his cartoonish style seems to me to have yoof appeal.

Colin YNWA

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Re: The completely self absorbed 2000ad re-read thread
« Reply #988 on: 28 August, 2020, 10:28:04 AM »
His recent 'appearance' on the Thrillcast was one of the few I've caught up with (got behind and slowly, very slowly trying to catch up - there's so many podcasts these days!) as I was intrigued on why he'd disappeared from, not just the Prog, but from what I can see comics in general, as he's a great artist. Seems he's just moved to different commercial work. He certianly doesn't seem to have closed any doors so fingers crossed. As you say his style would be perfect for Regened issues, if he was interested and had the time.

broodblik

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Re: The completely self absorbed 2000ad re-read thread
« Reply #989 on: 28 August, 2020, 07:42:34 PM »
It looks like his last work was done in the Megazine #333, in a JD story written by Alan Grant "Night Mayor on L.M. Street"
Old age is the Lord’s way of telling us to step aside for something new. Death’s in case we didn’t take the hint.

The pen is mightier than the sword if the sword is very short, and the pen is very sharp.