I don't understand the appeal of...

[Peter Wolf]

There was always an element of that "you are not cool enough to talk to" with Goths/Alternative types that i remember from Hastings.It was alright if you part of the clique but not much good if you werent but because Hastings was such a small place and there only being one alternative club/bar/venue [The Crypt] that was open after the pubs closed everyone knew each other and were forced to mix.Everyone who was anyone went to the same couple of pubs as well.Other alternative groups that you had then like Punks or Skinheads or those Psychobilly types that you got then all mixed together because we all shared the same pubs and bar.

There was no need for any superior shit because you only ever get that in larger towns and cities ande the smaller the place the more easy it is to get to know everyone.

[House of Usher]

The Eagle in 1980s Brighton was an old-fashioned pub, with a blazing fireplace, where there were bikers, who kept to themselves, goths, who kept to themselves, and metallers, who also kept to themselves. That's how it was back then. Goths haven't got any more stand-offish: quite the opposite. It's just that they've started sneering at the emo kids as an inferior brand.

[Mattofthespurs]

Kill em all, I say.

[vzzbux]

I think if your in a group like EMO's and its pissing off your peers then you work is done. Isn't that the aim of any group movement. Rap Rock Metal whatever Genre your part of. Worked for me.
SMASH THE SYSTEM






V

[Robin Low]

In Manchester big crowds of goths,emos and skater dudes hang out by the Urbis museum on a Saturday, and it warms my heart to see them. Okay they copy each other and I may chuckle at their ways, but compared to the vast majority of boring, short haired, sportswear-wearing kids around, I'm really glad that there are still loads who are happy to dress up stupidly and be part of a 'scene'. And it's often the fatter/spottier/uglier kids who have found acceptance, friendship or even girlfriends among their 'tribe', which they probably never would in the image-obsessed mainstream.

Gawd bless their dark little hearts I say! 

Late as usual to this discussion, but I have to agree with everything you've said.

More generally, I've found Goths to be friendlier, kinder, more socially aware and accepting, and generally more interesting than the mainstream and other subcultures. It has more than it's fair share of eccentrics and outright weirdoes, but so what.

Obviously, being increasingly elderly and out of touch, I've no real idea what the current generation is like, but the worst I can say is that they're a noisy bunch of little buggers.

I heard of a study a few years ago that showed that Goths generally end up with better paid jobs that non-Goths.


Regards

Robin

[Mike Gloady]

That bloody t-mobile band advert.

It crawls up my arsehole, snakes around my heart and lays little shitty eggs of death in my soul.  I want all involved to die.  HORRIBLY.

No.  That's unfair.  I want them to live, but to be scarred.  HORRIBLY.

[Tanky]

There was no need for any superior shit because you only ever get that in larger towns and cities and the smaller the place the more easy it is to get to know everyone.

Very true. It's the same here in Southsea. Small place, big alternative scene. I'm still DJing for a living and on an average Friday we have goths, punks, skins, metallers, emos, crusties, bikers, indie scenesters, psychobillies, mods - you name it! Everyone gets along famously and it makes for a very interesting playlist. (Except the pub golf crawls. They need to be beaten with their own plastic golf clubs.)

Now there's a thing I don't understand the appeal of - Pub golf. Seriously, wtf?

I'll stand up for the emos though. In my line of work, they pay my wages some nights and I'd rather play to them than a lot of other crowds. Believe it or not, they always have a lovely time and I don't think I've ever finished one of those nights without several free drinks inside me!

Oh, and incidentally, I played Temple of Love last night. Consider it belatedly dedicated to all the goths on this thread  x

[House of Usher]

I heard of a study a few years ago that showed that Goths generally end up with better paid jobs that non-Goths.

I don't believe it. Anecdotally I hear from fellow goths that they work in IT support, credit control, adult education, local government, laboratory science and creative endeavours, but just as many work in retail, hospitality, care homes, call centres and assembly plants. Not many of them are lawyers, corporate accountants or investment bankers. On the whole I don't think they are any more likely than average to be higher than basic rate taxpayers. If anything, less likely, given how few goths are police sergeants or senior nurses.

[staticgirl]

sniiiiiiiiiiiiiiiip!

Yup, it certainly is!

I felt compelled to reply to your post above, Staticgirl, just because I wanted to make sure there's no hard feelings about what I said.

Ultimately, while I've certainly got my entrenched opinions about things, I'd hate to think that we were all taking everybody's posts here in a spririt of deadly seriousness.

Peace, an' all that.

Oh don't worry, wasn't offended. Just going into bat for the teenies.

I think the goth scene changed a lot because it became European, rather than British. There's a lot more cross fertilisation between genres going on now. I'm glad personally. I think original goth died on its arse in the early 90s because the bands stopped innovating and all sounded like early Sisters. I love industrial and ebm so I'm glad that's done so well in the last 10 years.

Check out gloom-pop, btw. The NME have been making up genres again but I rather like the bands they are championing this time because they are influenced by the first generation of goth and post-punk. Could go places...

Right back to the topic....

I can't understand the appeal of:
Computer games.

Mainly because I have the coordination of a jellyfish and I want to be more passive when watching a story on a screen. I love the concept art though and have a gulity cartoon-crush on that fella from Assassins Creed.

[Dandontdare]

That bloody t-mobile band advert.

Oh yes. "Josh is organising a tour on Twitter". FUCK OFF! If Josh comes anywhere near me, he'll get his face punched.

[House of Usher]

I don't understand the appeal of naive art. At my local arts centre there's an installation by a gypsy artist who compares the treatment of gypsies in modern Europe to the persecution of witches in the early modern era. She does this through an installation composed of lots of plywood partitions, huts and tents full of scraps of fabric, 1960s dolls and other bits of cheap plastic, mannequins, illustrations from Ladybird books and photos of children from old knitting patterns. The backdrops are all scrawled over with gobbledigook and rhetorical questions about witch hunts, George Orwell, Dante (incongruously), and victimhood. The overall impression is of an artless shambles, lacking craft, and I wouldn't have known what it was about if it hadn't been for the helpful crib-sheet.

[TordelBack]

...Twitter.

[Mike Gloady]

Ush, TB: Agreed in SPADES. 

I feel like a phillistine (small "p", don't want to offend anyone) for not getting it, but I really don't.  And Twitter seems so pointless as to be almost a joke.  I already have a FB account, can't justify joining ANOTHER social network that I can't see the attraction to. 

[Peter Wolf]

That bloody t-mobile band advert.

It crawls up my arsehole, snakes around my heart and lays little shitty eggs of death in my soul.  I want all involved to die.  HORRIBLY.

No.  That's unfair.  I want them to live, but to be scarred.  HORRIBLY.

Its all rather Radio 2 and nice isnt it ?

I had best move on from this before i start ranting about what is wrong with music today.

Check out gloom-pop, btw. The NME have been making up genres again but I rather like the bands they are championing this time because they are influenced by the first generation of goth and post-punk. Could go places...

Can you name any of these Gloom-pop bands ? I am curious and i wouldnt mind a listen

Very true. It's the same here in Southsea. Small place, big alternative scene. I'm still DJing for a living and on an average Friday we have goths, punks, skins, metallers, emos, crusties, bikers, indie scenesters, psychobillies, mods - you name it! Everyone gets along famously and it makes for a very interesting playlist. (Except the pub golf crawls. They need to be beaten with their own plastic golf clubs.)

Now there's a thing I don't understand the appeal of - Pub golf. Seriously, wtf?



Oh, and incidentally, I played Temple of Love last night. Consider it belatedly dedicated to all the goths on this thread   x

That was what was good about the Crypt.It always had a varied playlist on a Friday and Saturday which included just about everything which always seemed to end with Petula Clark - Downtown.There was a 7foot model of Frankenstein in the corner by the DJ booth who was slowly decapitated with hands going missing and eventually the head which must have ended up as a prized exhibit in a Goths bedroom.

I don't understand the appeal of naive art. At my local arts centre there's an installation by a gypsy artist who compares the treatment of gypsies in modern Europe to the persecution of witches in the early modern era. She does this through an installation composed of lots of plywood partitions, huts and tents full of scraps of fabric, 1960s dolls and other bits of cheap plastic, mannequins, illustrations from Ladybird books and photos of children from old knitting patterns. The backdrops are all scrawled over with gobbledigook and rhetorical questions about witch hunts, George Orwell, Dante (incongruously), and victimhood. The overall impression is of an artless shambles, lacking craft, and I wouldn't have known what it was about if it hadn't been for the helpful crib-sheet.

That doesnt sound like the kind of Naive or folk art that i have seen.I like folk/naive art in the traditional sense if its paintings and furniture and ceramics and it often sells for big money if its 19th century or older.There used to be an antique shop that specialised in naive art in Tunbridge Wells.I have one or two pieces of ceramics that are spongeware and one is a cider mug.I dug up a sussexware harvest flagon once as well.

[Robin Low]

I heard of a study a few years ago that showed that Goths generally end up with better paid jobs that non-Goths.

I don't believe it. Anecdotally I hear from fellow goths that they work in IT support, credit control, adult education, local government, laboratory science and creative endeavours, but just as many work in retail, hospitality, care homes, call centres and assembly plants. Not many of them are lawyers, corporate accountants or investment bankers. On the whole I don't think they are any more likely than average to be higher than basic rate taxpayers. If anything, less likely, given how few goths are police sergeants or senior nurses.

The first thing you should remember is that I'm almost certainly misrepresenting the conclusions of this study, which, like the average journalist, I didn't actually read - looking back at what I wrote it sounds like I'm saying that Goths end up in the highest paying jobs. I suspect the actual conclusions were more along the lines of, 'Parents: don't worry about about your oddly dressed offspring - they are actually quite bright, sociable, get a half decent education and end up doing better than a significant portion of their less imaginative and less thoughtful contemporaries who are more into Kylie.'


Regards

Robin